A correction to my writing of last week. There were 50-60 clergy and lay
persons standing up front in silence as a District Superitendent read the statement.
I am one of the clergy - lest I bear false witness. That is in the 10
Commandments, so I take it seriously. We stood in dignity and solidarity with
sisters and brothers whom God loves and affirmed them as one of us.
From: Norman L. Ramsey III <email@example.com>
To: firstname.lastname@example.org <email@example.com>
Date: Thursday, June 15, 2000 1:02 PM
Subject: All Hell Broke Loose at New England Conference
Amy, it is not necessarily an inappropriate or unloving thing to call someone worthless when it comes to them exercising God-given authority in an ungodly way or refusing to act to uphold righteous standards. Jesus said, "If salt loses its saltiness, it is worthless." Was He being unloving? No, Jesus was just making sure that His disciples understood, "Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven." Let's not let our light be darkness.
I am ashamed and stunned by the actions of these prohomosexual pastors at the N.E. Conference. They should all be reprimanded and the Bishop also held accountable for her weak answer! What can we do as United Methodists to make sure this rebellious agenda doesn't happen?
The comments of one called Dan concern me. Calling a bishop worthless? Perhaps Dan needs to revisit Christianity and specifically, 1 Corinthians 13. I hear a lot of gonging going on. I wonder if Dan feels best when he diminishes others? I was at the New England Annual Conference and experienced no shouting or anything close to it. Amy Alletzhauser, Elder in full connection NEC
How fortunate that the Annual Conference was taped. Someone should inform the lay person from Naples that there is a commandment about lying but not one about homosexuality. I was one of the 40 or 50 laypersons standing up front during the report of the Reconciling Ministries. There was a theological statement read and the signers stood up front in absolute silence while it was read. The only person who shouted was the Rev. Fitz Allen John (yes, the black one has a name. He is a retired pastor and former District Superintendent in the Caribbean. He is someone I have worked with and respected for many years). He did not cause pandemonium, but merely was strident in his attempt to interrupt the reading of the document. The bishop did not allow him to do that, but recognized him in the appropriate place - when the reading was concluded. Many of us were able to converse with Rev. John in mutual respect after the session. To have you folk who were not there spreading such foolish rumors speaks loudly of the hatred and fear in your hearts. God bless you and give you peace. The children of John Wesley have always stood for and with those whom the powers and principalities within God's church would exclude while praying for grace and mercy to come to those who exclude them. Such is our prayer for you.
In Christ's love,
Doug Mays' second-hand report seems to pretty much concur with the "official" report of what happened at New England Annual Conference, so I don't think the concerns expressed by "David" are legitimate. The lies, demonizations and inaccuracies are solely the property the heirs of Sodom and Gomorrah. They had promised to leave if they didn't get their way in Cleveland. But it is obvious now that their word is DIRT.
If "David" is so concerned about truth and accuracy, why does he hide behind a pseudonym? How can we be sure he was really "there" if he does not identify who he is and where he is from?
James Gibson Marshallville United Methodist Church http://sites.netscape.net/saginazmon/homepage
The above picture looks like a bunch of folks in line at the Greyhound Bus Depot for
the next bus to hell. Bishops? I'd say apostates.
As a Pastor who was present at the conference the last letter is a gross miss-statement to the dignity and accuracy of what took place at our Annual Conference. There was no shouting, there was no pandemonium, there was nothing but thoughtful people, struggling with discerning the will of God who stood and said clearly and unequivocally that General Conference did not speak for them, despite efforts on the part of some to say that the definitive stance has been arrived at.
I too am disgusted... not by what happened but by blatant lies about what happened. God is not served by our demonizing each other. If you are going to post things like this on the Internet, at least make sure they are truthful and accurate!
I don't mean to a fly in the ointment, but I do question leaving. Where can one go? If Jesus didn't stop being a Jew because the Jews didn't accept His message, if Jesus didn't stop being the Messiah even when He knew He'd be crucified, how can we leave the UMC when there's nothing perfect (or better) out there somewhere else?
Lauffer's gone; he no longer has comment. "Can't stand it anymore...?" Baloney!!! If this is what gets us down and causes us to leave, then we are the weakest people around, and most to be pitied. If we were being tortured, our families and friends being killed before our eyes, our churches being bombed, then there's a consideration; but even then, the Christians around the world who are being tortured, killed and bombed are still Christians. This issue is a nit on a dog compared to what Christians in Muslim countries are going through. I could understand leaving as the better part of valor if we were cornered, but WE'RE NOT CORNERED!!! Leaving over this issue when God and our people need us to stand is the height of weakness and defeat. What are we teaching our children?
We've already won the victory! Why quit now when it's just gettin' fun?! Stay and stand or leave and be quiet.
Rusty Dickerson (UM pastor for 16 years)
Again you have a bunch of loudmouths who think they know it all and who ignore votes at the conference. Either they should abide by the votes or get out, to Metropolitain Community Churches if they continue these disruptions. Hopefully strong stands will be taken on this. The will and spirit of the conference and of the Discipline is being totally ignored. Enough is enough.
Doug: Somehow I am not surprised. Of course, we knew it was not going away just because of the General Conference Actions. One good action which GC took was allowing the AC to separate World Service and Conference Benevolences. We need to be sure that our AC does it. See you in a few days.
Yes, the demons did break forth. But thank God for the black pastor who spoke up. Maybe there are some Christians left in the UMC who have the backbone to take these devils to trial. I pray that you do.
After 26 years as a UMC Elder in the Northern Ill. Conference I've retired early, at age 52 and am joining the Catholics. I can't stand it anymore. I fought. I filed a formal complaint against Sprague. Nothing came of it. But you all are in my prayers. Go fight God's battle. Be His warriors!!
Maybe there are some Christians left in the UMC. Take the demons to court and get them thrown out, including the worthless bishop.
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